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PB & Jason   

PB & Jason Issue 74: Giant Bowling Balls Are Not Our Friends

The Simpsons Arcade is headed to consoles soon! Jason is happy.

This week's PB & Jason is full of great stuff. Inside, you'll find a certain PixlBit blog featured! Also discover news regarding things like NetFlix, PSN+, and Club Nintendo! Add in a bit of musing about Skyrim and Kingdoms of Amalur, then mix in a peck of an upcoming feature about what's in store for us with the Wii U, and you'll find this week's best PB & Jason issue, ever! Click through the article to find the podcast.

Of course, those with listener mail can always contact me by sending email to jason@pixlbit.com. Come back next week for Issue 75! I'm sure it'll be next week's best ever PB & Jason, too!


 

Comments

Angelo Grant Staff Writer

02/02/2012 at 10:38 AM

Ha Ha Jason, Ha Ha... :D

So about the Skyrim thing.  I know I probably don't speak for the majority in this case, but I very much enjoyed (and still enjoy, Etrian Odyssey!!!) isometric dungeon crawlers years ago.  One of the reasons I enjoy Elder Scrolls games so much is they seem very much like a mondern take on that genre.  I think the combat failure is just an evolutionary hold over from the genre's roots.  It actually feels like there's a timer restraining how often you can swing or execute an action, and a dice roll for each attack, even though it's real time.

Where the game really shines is the sense of exploration.  That's what I, and the majority of gamers, play the game for.  It's what I love about the genre more than the combat.  Seriously, I've been playing these for so long that when they came out with the Phantasy Star collection on the GBA, I was able to play through the first game for the first time without writing down a map.

And yes, I still have a pack of graph paper in my desk somewhere.

Jason Ross Senior Editor

02/02/2012 at 04:28 PM

With Skyrim, what do you typically find when you explore? For example, what if you venture through a snowy, mountainous region only to come face to face with a dragon? Boom. Enter combat scenario, you can fight or you can run. In whatever case, chances are, it's going to be a very bland experience. When you defeat the dragon and stumble upon some sort of rune, you gain....

...An ability that increases your fighting proficiency a little bit. Great! I'm not saying there isn't a sense of exploration in the game, but from what I've seen, quite a bit of it ties into fighting proficiency and such.

Then, I start to wonder things like this: If you don't play the game for some experience with the combat, why not just play Animal Crossing? No, it doesn't have a wide-open, massive world, but at the same time, you won't have to worry about some giant attacking you and flinging you two hundred feet in the air, nor will you have to worry about how long it takes to travel from place to place. If the combat really gives the feeling of recreating the roll of the die in Dungeons and Dragons, it certainly lacks the options for creativity, personality, and sense of comraderie playing a table top game offers.

With older isometric dungeon crawlers, in my limited experience, the combat was simplified. What mattered was what you equipped and how you approached a situation. How you clicked once in a fight seemed a little less relevant, aside from things like timing of spells. With Skyrim, seeing the game played, it looks more like a dull first-person shooter/brawler. Sure, you can equip things, but so many spells are so similar, so many approaches to each fight are the same: Attack and then dodge the enemy's straight-forward attack. Yeah, dragons are slightly different, yeah, giants are slightly different, but from what I've seen, not so much.

Anyway, the point was more about the way many critics and individuals are reacting to Kingdoms of Amalur: When it's boiled down, they're essentially saying the game is like Skyrim if Skyrim were fun to play. That puzzles me. A few months ago, to many people, Skyrim was one of the best titles of this generation. Here we are, a few months passed, and suddenly Skyrim is a great game by their standards, but not one that people enjoy playing. Do you see the contrast here? Are people that short-sighted?

Angelo Grant Staff Writer

02/02/2012 at 06:04 PM

Ah, but the gain in fighting ability then allows you to explore locations previously inaccessable, at least that's how the games were originally.  I really think level scaling has done this, and Oblivion, a horrible disservice.  I still enjoy my time with them, but this may be the ever cloudy nostalgia talking.  My favorites in the series were Daggerfall and Morrowind by a considerable margin. There has been an obvious distancing from the isometric dungeon crawler roots with the later two game, especially in combat, which is what makes it feel sloppy and un fun.  It's stuck in some awkward limbo where it seems like it has a strong desire to move into first person shooter turf (to an extent) but it seems unwilling to drop its RPG roots enough to truly do so, which is what you seem to be experiencing.

Frankly, it's not my favorite thing either.

I think Bethesda is scared to chase away the people who were there from the earlier games, but you know what? I wish they would just commit fully to something.  I'm OK with the combat the way it is now, but I don't love it.  I love the character growth system (which is satisfying in a similar way to discovering things in the world) but franky, if they put a little more call of duty into my D&D, I wouldn't mind, just as long as it worked.

Imagine if you will, Borderlands level combat in a Bethesda world with the existing character growth system.  That gets me a little excited.

I think The Elder Scrolls is going to get there, but there's going to be some awkward teenage years in between.  I think now that all the fans are complaining about is the combat, that will probably be their next big focus.  

I'm rambling, but let me wrap up with this: I do see your point, but I still like the game for what it is, and I think a lot of people did, More to your point, I don't get Critics either sometimes, or other gamers for that matter.  How can you say you played a game for 60+ hours and it wasn't fun to play?  Did your 360's disk tray break and this was the game that was stuck in it?  Clearly people were indeed having fun with the game.  I think a lot of what we see here is (very short term) revisionist reviewing.  LIke the people who say FF VII sucked even though it was a very good game at the time.  Skyrim is one of those games thats getting the same unfair shake because it's a transitional title.  Games WILL come around that do it better because that's the nature of things.  In this case, it just looks like it happened very very fast.

Our Take

Jason Ross Senior Editor

02/08/2012 at 08:25 PM

Hey everyone, I wanted to give a heads up: I'm feeling a little under the weather today, so PB & Jason won't be happening this week. If it weren't a sore throat, I'd still be doing it! Tune in next week, I'll be providing listeners with a Vita launch special! Exciting!

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